Author Topic: NEW Electronic Ignition Option  (Read 1530 times)

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Offline dailydose1

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NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« on: September 26, 2018, 01:08:23 PM »
https://www.ebay.com/itm/YAMAHA-1975-1978-XS500c-1973-1974-TX500-ELECTRONIC-IGNITION-TYRTRONIC/113256295997?hash=item1a5e99ee3d:g:52sAAOSwXZZboFq1

I hadn't seen this option before, looks like a cost effective option for electronic ignition....


*I have run this brand with my cb350 and it worked without issue so I have had apositive experience*

Online guylr

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2018, 03:43:06 PM »
I'm going to assume that this retains the governor assembly. Essentially it's like the old Pertronic pickups that were available for cars back in the 70s to replace the points. As such it doesn't not control iming advance and retard so it needs to use the existing governor. If it doesn't then don't get it.

Guy
« Last Edit: September 27, 2018, 01:26:40 AM by guylr »
Now Retired Yamaha guy. Cut me and I bleed "Cinquasia Red"

Offline dailydose1

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2018, 03:48:24 PM »
Correct, it uses the advance governor but has its own rotor. Interesting it says xs500c but not e or d. I have messaged for more info and will let you know if I hear anything

Offline lumpy252

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2020, 01:00:38 PM »
This maybe an old thread but the link says they have just one left if anyone fancies taking a punt. I did as I was sufficiently intrigued. Shipping from US to UK may take some time though and perhaps customs will require extra payment before delivery . Happy New Year .

Offline lumpy252

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2020, 02:19:17 PM »
On further examination the postage address is China not US (dollars used in both ) any how we will see what happens .

Offline lumpy252

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2020, 08:29:46 PM »
Hi again just to update , I was pleasantly surprised when after ten days the system arrived . I have experimented on a spare governor plate that I acquired with my bike. This showed that the rotor fits and the replacement plate that the sensors are mounted on lines up with the original points plates dimensions. The rotor has two magnets to trigger the sensors to fire the cylinders. The only thing that I need confirmation on is the live feed to the systems red wire. The instructions say to take the live feed from the brown positive wire from the ignition switch ( and not the ignition coils as the newtronics system does). I am pretty sure that this means to split a brown wire at the switch but have emailed the manufacturer to confirm . So as yet it is not installed on the bike but it looks promising.

Offline quattrodave

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2020, 02:17:15 PM »
So,

I ordered the last one of these ignition triggers from ebay on Sunday 2nd Feb around 14:00 UK time, it arrived this morning at midday, not bad to say it came from a mainland China supplier I thought the country is supposed to be in lockdown with the corona virus ?

I found some better instructions on the web for these points replacement triggers, basically the 2 outputs go to each coil negative side (get them the right way round or the bike won;t fire), the red wire needs a positive feed as does the positive side of the coils, the condensors need to be taken out of the circuit, does that make sense ?, might fit this weekend.

Oh and no import tax as the export form on the package said $10 value.

Offline quattrodave

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2020, 03:03:54 PM »
So the negative feed from the triggers is the correct colours for the XS500B points feed so assuming the plug is the same as that already attached to the bikes points it should be a straight swap.
Don't know why they don't want the red + supply to be the same circuit as the coils as thats from the on/off engine stop switch on the bars as logically its where it should be for a switched positive supply, just make sure that the condensors are not in the circuit once wired up, says it needs 3 ohm or OEM coil so I will test existing coils before fitting.

Offline lumpy252

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2020, 04:35:27 PM »
Hi Quattrodave I have not fitted mine yet as the email response from the manufacturer in China asked for photos as the earlier and then later (76 on models ) had different wiring. The kit does list all models as being compatible. Like you say the negative wires are in the correct fitting to snap right on to the existing socket. The positive wire was my question for the manufacturer as its feed is stated as being from a brown ( ignition on off switched) wire.
The instructions are a bit vague as they are printed in dodgy English on half a side of A4 paper . I have an older xs500b and a later xs500d so I wanted to know the difference if any of the live feed location. If you are fitting soon be prepared for the small circlip on the governor bob weights to break in half when taking them off to fit the new rotor. I got some replacements for these from a bearing suppliers over the counter. 
My instinct is to split a live switched (ignition )wire to supply the new unit though I was going to see where the tytronic people said first. It should all be as easy as it seems . Thanks for the response and also thank you to dailydose for the idea .

Offline lumpy252

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2020, 11:23:07 PM »
Hi all just had a go at connecting the tytronic kit up to my xs500b to see how far i could get before I need clarification from the manufacturer. So I have put the  pointer to the F1 position on the governor,then installed the  new rotor on the governor and installed the plate with the sensors . The grey and orange wires to the two pin socket do fit straight into the bikes existing loom connection and I have removed the condensers.
One unforeseen thing I did do was file a small chamfer on the lower edge of the new rotor so that it would fit properly and rotate freely . This was done after checking the original Yamaha rotor to make them match and now they work the same.  I have emailed the manufacturer with photos of what I have done and asked them to say if the instructions with the kit are accurate when they say to take the live feed from a brown ignition controlled wire. Then there is the question of where to connect a test lamp to time the system.
I was thinking that the socket that the condensers were connected to could be used for this purpose (one at a time for each cylinder , orange wire to test lamp to earth for left cylinder then grey wire to test lamp to earth for right cylinder). I will post some photos of the rotors and the governor assemblies.

Offline lumpy252

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #10 on: February 08, 2020, 02:06:20 AM »
 Here is a picture of the tytronic rotor on the ATU/governor

Offline lumpy252

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #11 on: February 08, 2020, 11:25:41 AM »
Ok so I have just seen a YouTube video about these kits and the test light is a part of the red senses that are the pick ups for the magnets signal . Also the guy on the vid just rigged a wire from the ignition switch ( long extra wire to make up). He did this on an xs650 but it helps with what I wanted to know. I am going to have another look at this all now and see what happens .

Offline quattrodave

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #12 on: February 08, 2020, 12:00:25 PM »
You just wanted to beat me to installation !

Did you check the coil resistance and is it greater than the 3 ohm as they recommend ?

I would expect to have some minor fettling to get the advance working smoothly as you experienced. I also expect that it may be necessary to create some adjustment on one of the pickups to allow the timing to be set precisely on both cylinders as per the original points. 

I note that your pickups appear to have a 2019.?? date on them thats interesting as the pickups in my kit have 2020 02 on them which implies the kit was assembled to order as I assume the 2020 02 indicates a February 2020 manufacture date ?

Anyhows looks like I won't be installing mine this weekend as I've just volunteered to assist my neighbour in doing the head gasket on his newly acquired 1948 Morris 8 sidevalve saloon, just arrived from Bristol to Bingley 10 days ago and hes done 1 trip of 5 miles in it and the head gasket failed hes not happy as it cost him 6000 bought unseen on recommendation of a member on the Morris 8 register.

Oh the joys of classic motoring !


Offline lumpy252

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2020, 07:23:28 PM »

Hi again did not get finished today as the test lights are not inbuilt in my tytronic sensors like the youtube vid showed. Anyhow I rigged my trusty old indicator test light into the circuit (see photo). Yes the ignition coils are the right resistance OEM coils are fitted . i took live feed from a brown ignition wire in the headlight and fitted the appropriate connectors to wires for my test light and the tytronics system feed. Only thing is that now the test light goes out at the F1 mark instead of beginning to light up. as normally happens with the points . the rotor is not 180 degrees out as it is faceing the orange wired pick up with the black magnet like the instructions say. I will continue to press on tomorrow , the finish line is not far away .

Offline lumpy252

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Re: NEW Electronic Ignition Option
« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2020, 03:38:55 PM »
Good news the bike runs fine . Turns out that the test lamp that was seemingly working back to front was somehow correct , maybe because the test lamp was a part of the circuit rather than being grounded to earth as is normally the case when doing points timing . So the kit does work straight out of the box at least as far as wiring goes. Like I wrote I did file a chamfer onto the new rotor lower edge to make it rotate with the governor springs on the shaft ( like the original Yamaha item).
The instructions reference to a test lamp must therefore mean a strobe , which is operating as it should being in between the two advance marks . Like you say quattrodave I sort of did want to beat you to install this  :)